I got a question

[blackstig]

If I were to pick this car up

http://atlanta.craigslist.org/car/474657820.html

How difficult would modification be, like, where the HELL would I find performance parts and upgrades for such a rediculously old 5 series?

It probably makes more than enough power on that nikasil engine (which is probably on the way out as we speak) but how the heck do you manage suspension and stuff.

This is part . . .oh I don't know . . . . 17 of my "Search For A Track Car" issue.

Rule of thumb that ALL racers should live by . . .do not spend more than 1000 bucks on something you're just going to rebuild/replace the engine on and snatch the interior out of anyway.

It's a good rule and everyone that I've taught it to lives by it to this day with an extremely high success rate.

Anyhow, yeah, let me know.

-Stig

[Philip]

looks a little rough. Personally, I'd look for a blown-motor E30 for a stripped down track car. Thee's a much better after-market for it.

[Bill-B]

That car does not look very desireable unless you are good with body work, or can get it done cheap somehwhere

[Lsixer]

That car does not look very desireable unless you are good with body work, or can get it done cheap somehwhere

OT, sorry stig.

Hi Bill! http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w245/lsixer/wave2-1.gif

Ok, back to your regulary scheduled program.

[blackstig]

looks a little rough. Personally, I'd look for a blown-motor E30 for a stripped down track car. Thee's a much better after-market for it.

I feel ya on that one, but I can't find any E30s that I would like to track out . . . *sigh*

I think I'm just going to stick with my original plans of working with the AE86.

-Stig

[88e28]

What about using my car. Look at post "moving my car".

[Philip]

I feel ya on that one, but I can't find any E30s that I would like to track out . . . *sigh*

I think I'm just going to stick with my original plans of working with the AE86.

-Stig

I would love to see a M50/M52'ed Hachi.

[88e28]

That car does not look very desireable unless you are good with body work, or can get it done cheap somehwhere

First Post . Welcome to the Club.

[88e28]

I would love to see a M50/M52'ed Hachi.

Philip, Did you get my PM today?

[Mitch]

Actually you can find performance parts around for these. They make pretty decent race cars, although not too light.

[Philip]

Philip, Did you get my PM today?

I did, thanks Wayne. It's been ridiculously busy today and I haven't even had enough time time to call them yet though. It's definitely worth checking into.

[BMRSEB]

Hey Stig.. Give Calvin at Import Service a call, 770-428-3876, 1155 South Cobb Dr. Suite B., Marietta, GA 30060.

He usually has some E30's, E28's around. His shop does work/service on BMW's, MB's, etc. Tell him I rec'd you to him.. :)

On a side note, he's also looking to hosting tech sessions, etc., at his shop on South Cobb Drive. :) We need to get him on ClubBimmer and set something up.

[blackstig]

Hey Stig.. Give Calvin at Import Service a call, 770-428-3876, 1155 South Cobb Dr. Suite B., Marietta, GA 30060.

He usually has some E30's, E28's around. His shop does work/service on BMW's, MB's, etc. Tell him I rec'd you to him.. :)

On a side note, he's also looking to hosting tech sessions, etc., at his shop on South Cobb Drive. :) We need to get him on ClubBimmer and set something up.

Werd, I'll definitely give him a call, just remember my rule of thumb when buying a track car, some people will definitely ask a lot of a car especially if they think you're going to use it for something besides just sitting there.

I'll let him know you sent me, do you know when the best time to call him is?

I'd love to stick with BMW's through and through but man . . .800 bucks for a Hachi Roku, you can't beat that, Chris definitely would be giving me a car that would need some attention but ehhhh. . .for 800 bucks what do you want?

-Stig

[atl530i]

Honestly, that would not make a good track car. The E12 528i made more power and torque then the 530i. The 530i had a lot of issues with the thermal reactors and heads. A lot of heads cracked or blew back in the day. So bad BMW issued a bulletin to fix all the M30 cars with cracked heads. What you can do is take the M30B30 out and swap in an M30B34. I can list off a lot of other things that can go wrong with one of those (mainly because I'm going thru E12 hell right now) if you want.

[blackstig]

I feel you on that one, to be honest, I kinda miss my 89 535i . . .oh well, it's not guaranteed that I'll stick with BMW anyway. Nissan, Mitsubishi, Toyota and Mazda are still very possible candidates.

When tuning and racing, first comes the ability to build, then comes the ability to be unique. Sorry BMW, but modification and repair simply cost too much . . . .depending on how things go . . .nah . . .I won't say that yet . . .that may actually tick some people off.

-Stig

[atl530i]

I'd say Honda or Nissan if you plan on building a DEPENDABLE track car. I had an EF (ED here in the US) hatch I swapped a B16 into and tracked it here and there. Dependable on the track and on the way home :) The only thing I hate about Honda are timing belts. But those are pretty easy after the first one.

[blackstig]

I'd say Honda or Nissan if you plan on building a DEPENDABLE track car. I had an EF (ED here in the US) hatch I swapped a B16 into and tracked it here and there. Dependable on the track and on the way home :) The only thing I hate about Honda are timing belts. But those are pretty easy after the first one.

Very true, I've seen the Hondas dominate the FWD class, and to be perfectly honest, if I wasn't planning on doing more than just time trials (read as NASA and SCCA club trials, rally and time trials) I would go with one of those, FWD cars are selling for great prices, especially the EKs and EGs.

I love BMW . . .but I don't know, after returning from a mechanic's inspection yesterday, I'm in very high disregard for the future of BMW ownership :(

-Stig

[88e28]

Stig you leaving us? No more BMW?

[blackstig]

I'm not saying that I'd give up on BMW altogether, it just costs too much to fix these ***** things. I just found out that my BMW needs the seals on the steering box replaced and that's 5 hours in the shop plus the price of the seals. *sigh*

Daily driving, I guess it's not too bad save for the gas.

Performance wise . . . I can get further, faster and for less money if I go Japanese.

If I can, I'm probably going to go with either a 280ZX or an AE86 for a track car. If I can find someone to buy my 540i, then . . . I probably will steer clear of BMW for a bit as well.

-Stig

[atl530i]

What is wrong with your BMWs?? Or that E12? NVM... ^^^ How much for the 540i?

An E30 would be the only BMW I'd consider for a track car. Simple to work on.

[Philip]

I feel you on that one, to be honest, I kinda miss my 89 535i . . .oh well, it's not guaranteed that I'll stick with BMW anyway. Nissan, Mitsubishi, Toyota and Mazda are still very possible candidates.

When tuning and racing, first comes the ability to build, then comes the ability to be unique. Sorry BMW, but modification and repair simply cost too much . . . .depending on how things go . . .nah . . .I won't say that yet . . .that may actually tick some people off.

-Stig

If you need any help with an S13 of any type, I can probably hang upside down and disassemble one, clean it, and put it back together before I get a nosebleed. lol

[blackstig]

If you need any help with an S13 of any type, I can probably hang upside down and disassemble one, clean it, and put it back together before I get a nosebleed. lol

LMAO! Thanks, I'll definitely keep that in mind . . .do the boys over at Global want a 95 540i with the Alusil recall swap? You know what that means . . .4.4 components on the inside ^_^

Explains quite a bit . . .

HAHAHA!

-Stig

[Philip]

LMAO! Thanks, I'll definitely keep that in mind . . .do the boys over at Global want a 95 540i with the Alusil recall swap? You know what that means . . .4.4 components on the inside ^_^

Explains quite a bit . . .

HAHAHA!

-Stig

Is that the Nikasil replacement thing?

[Justin]

Yeah i can help you out with s13's also :)

[blackstig]

Is that the Nikasil replacement thing?

Yes sir! All I can say is drive it . . .but then again, you probably already know how it feels, LOL!

Yeah i can help you out with s13's also :)

Sweet deal, I was thinking the S13 route because the ones that are pretty much shell's only are selling for really great prices. However, even though I've owned one (as you can tell in the Stig Video Thread) I'm not a big fan of the 240, nothing against it, just too many people in such a short period of time owning/wanting one has made the car less attractive and more expensive.

-Stig

[88e28]

I'm not saying that I'd give up on BMW altogether, it just costs too much to fix these ***** things. I just found out that my BMW needs the seals on the steering box replaced and that's 5 hours in the shop plus the price of the seals. *sigh*

Daily driving, I guess it's not too bad save for the gas.

Performance wise . . . I can get further, faster and for less money if I go Japanese.

If I can, I'm probably going to go with either a 280ZX or an AE86 for a track car. If I can find someone to buy my 540i, then . . . I probably will steer clear of BMW for a bit as well.

-Stig

Talk to Philip he has a e30m with a blown motor at his work.

[Philip]

Talk to Philip he has a e30m with a blown motor at his work.

This is true. I could possibly get some contact information for the kid that owns it.

[Justin]

Sweet deal, I was thinking the S13 route because the ones that are pretty much shell's only are selling for really great prices. However, even though I've owned one (as you can tell in the Stig Video Thread) I'm not a big fan of the 240, nothing against it, just too many people in such a short period of time owning/wanting one has made the car less attractive and more expensive.

-Stig

You are right about that they have just taking off in the past couple of years! Honestly all they are are cheap speed! I mean i have got like 3000 in mine and it will run with the M3 speed wise. The freakin kbb on them are like 1000 for a good running one but yet they can sell for up to 3,500 with a good running KA.

[blackstig]

You are right about that they have just taking off in the past couple of years! Honestly all they are are cheap speed! I mean i have got like 3000 in mine and it will run with the M3 speed wise. The freakin kbb on them are like 1000 for a good running one but yet they can sell for up to 3,500 with a good running KA.

Yeah, true, however, when it comes to performance, track and street dominance, the price of bringing a Japanese car up to spec vise that of almost any European car save for Volkswagen is just crazy.

5,000 bucks, I can get a 240sx, AE86, Supra, 300ZX or 280ZX, new suspension (which includes bushings, bars and links), rebuild the engine, probably boost the engine and work on a lot of other things while still getting 20+ mpg around town.

5,000 bucks into a BMW, even an E30 or E36 doesn't go very far, not as far as it would in the Japanese market, yeah, BMW has a higher quality car that's more fun to drive stock, but once you strip the interior, start seriously modifying the suspension, those cars start to get closer and closer, then you get into the budget and the Japs just drive away with the checkered flag! :icon15:

-Stig

[Philip]

Yeah, true, however, when it comes to performance, track and street dominance, the price of bringing a Japanese car up to spec vise that of almost any European car save for Volkswagen is just crazy.

5,000 bucks, I can get a 240sx, AE86, Supra, 300ZX or 280ZX, new suspension (which includes bushings, bars and links), rebuild the engine, probably boost the engine and work on a lot of other things while still getting 20+ mpg around town.

5,000 bucks into a BMW, even an E30 or E36 doesn't go very far, not as far as it would in the Japanese market, yeah, BMW has a higher quality car that's more fun to drive stock, but once you strip the interior, start seriously modifying the suspension, those cars start to get closer and closer, then you get into the budget and the Japs just drive away with the checkered flag! :icon15:

-Stig


Unfortunately the black man speaks the truth. I have a dream that one day it will be just as cheap to mod my E36 as it was for my 240SX's.

[blackstig]

Unfortunately the black man speaks the truth. I have a dream that one day it will be just as cheap to mod my E36 as it was for my 240SX's.

I mean, even with like the E30, the parts aren't crazy expensive, but 100 bucks here, 50 bucks there 75 dollars over here and that all adds up . . .lets buy and modify a track car BMW E30 right here right now and lets do the same with a car I'm interested in . . .the 280zx

We'll use my favorite place to buy parts . . .Ebay Motors.

E30:
Car - http://atlanta.craigslist.org/car/476744809.html . . . . It's $750 and needs a transmission, so that's the first thing, then she'll need a tune up (which includes an oil change, filters change, plugs and wires)

Transmission- $500 plus shipping so roughly $795 after shipping.

Tune up:
Oil - 7 quarts? at 3.99 per quart
Plugs - 2.98 for the cheapos, 5.00 for the good ones, times 6
Wires - 160ish, I just did a rough average between the good ones and the cheap ones.
Fuel Filter - 27 Bucks?
Distributor - 92

And that's just back into driving condition, not including the tow home.

Lets now look at a car I'm looking at . . .

S30
Car - http://atlanta.craigslist.org/car/474930559.html $800

Bodywork: Probably about 400, but that's fixed and color matched with a coat of blue.

Exhaust: 220 for the header + 160 for the cat back . . .that's performance upgraded

It's already got a rebuilt engine, but lets pretend it didn't and we would do a tune up

Oil - We already know oil is 3.99 a quart, that engine holds 6 quarts
Plugs - Plug price is set at the same price
Wires - This is where the fun starts people . . . 25 bucks
Distributor - 11 bucks . . .come on!!!
Fuel Filter - 12 dollars . . . you know what . . .I'll stop

It's obvious . . .repairing, maintaining and modifying a Japanese performance vehicle is a lot cheaper than it's German counterpart . . .do you really get more from Germany . . yes . . .stock for stock . . .after modification comes into effect, I'm sorry, 240s are starting to look more and more appealing :(

-Stig

[88e28]

Why have a BMW if You can't afford them? This is a statement I hear from My repair shop alot. I love them, thats why I have two.

[kendogg]

Those are poor examples of what to look at for price comparisons for a car you plan to modify. For you, I wouldn't recommend an E30. An E30 is a great car for the beginner, a novice, but a E36 is a MUCH more refined vehicle, better suspension geometry, better grip, drivability, etc., etc. etc. And early OBD1 models can be had VERY cheap now. I wll be upgrading my E30 at some point to a <$1k E36. Strip, add TRM software, suspension, and I'm going to have fun :)

Japanese car with a $12 set of wires - I'd bet money you'll be modifying the ignition system. There's a few hundred right there. Stock coils on an E36 are just fine with 600+ horse.

Filters are cheap maintenance items. If filters/fluids are <$100 per car, then it should be a non-issue. I'd be running expensive syn gear lubes in any car I'd be taking on track anyways, and oil is the same price for every car - so not sure the point of your comparison there. And I'm also not sure where you're getting your plug pricing from. BMW's (ALL of them) run fantastically with copper NGK's. Just need to replace them a bit more often is all (same interval as you'd be replacing them on a jap car).

If you want exhaust - either S52 stock manifolds, or ebay euro header clones for <$250. The rest is all generic stuff, and will all be the same prices anyways. Headers or S52 manifolds with software to take advantage of it WILL make a bit of power, especially up-top. It's catbacks and/or midpipes on otherwise stock E36's that make little to no power gains.

And depending on what you are looking for, suspension probably is a bit more expensive. There are more bushings to replace, but good quality poly bushings are coming down in price. if you're looking at coilovers - a difference of ~$500 also shouldn't sway your decision much either.

Not trying to force an E36 down your throat. But you're looking at this from completely the WRONG perspective, especially in the cost format.

[Justin]

^ good point